The Reiki Cafe 

reikicurmudgeon said on

>prosperity,
>
>Hi.
>
>If you are suggesting that breath = spirit, then are you also saying that when we die and our breathing ceases spirit ceases as well?
>
>:)
>
>Cheers,
>
>RC

Maybe it's more like the idea expressed by the phrase "Give up the ghost." Last exhalation = (literal) expiration of what gives life to the material body?

Bruce

Bruce,

Hi,

So, are you saying that it is spirit that gives life to the material body? And, perhaps it is the ghost that gives up on us? lol

:)

Cheers,

RC

reikicurmudgeon said on

>Bruce,
>
>Hi,
>
>So, are you saying that it is spirit that gives life to the material body?

Cf. account in Genesis, of God breathing life into Adam's body that was molded from clay. I'm saying it's a belief that's out there, and that it's reflected in the use of the phrase of "Give up the ghost" to describe the transition from life to death.

Bruce

Bruce,

Hi,

I suspected we would get to god breathing life into adam, etc. I might be more inclined (but don't quote me) to think that maybe god made atom and from that the big bang 'occurred'. Perhaps the big bang could be thought of as the 'breath' with which 'Atom' was animated. :) After that? Well, just see how we have evolved. lol And, I am not sure that when I die I will transition to death. Such and assertion might imply that death is a state of existence. :)

Cheers,

RC

Hello, RC,

Perhaps the big bang could be thought of as the 'breath' with which 'Atom' was enervated. :)

Did you mean "energized?"

Bruce

Bruce,

Hi,

Yes, I intended to say animated. Ah, how intentions can sometimes go awry and mindfulness descend into mindlessness.

lol

Cheers,

RC

Thank you for the definition - and I think it supports what I was trying to say - all that breathes is in some way spiritual.

Mind you, the fact that God is said to have breathed life into Adam holds something else within it - Coming back to evolutionary psychology, the difference between humans and nature is said to be the ability to override instinct (free will).

Could that be the breath that was somehow different in definition than what animated the rest of nature?

Animus/anima is another word for spirit, isn't it? Maybe we could compare its root meaning (movement) with breath.

So, what is it to be spiritual?

Can it include the assumption that spirituality is "good" and being non-spiritual (if there is such a thing) "bad"?

Would we then come to the conclusion that there is a Lucifer at war against God?

By the way, I've always been fascinated by the fact that the devil has a name with "light" in it. It is said in the mystic teachings of İslam that the Devil is God's beloved.

Anyway,

Time to rest the spirit for me.

Good night everyone.

Esin

Otoharo!

We meditate to connect with our own divinity. It is the divinity that is the spiritual part. The act of getting there is breath work and whatever else we have come to use. In my opinion.

finality

Otoharo!

While I am stating my opinion, I will go a step further. All this discussion seems to me to be head talking. Divinity is not in the head nor does the head have a function in it. Our deepest beingness is our spirituality, our divinity. No where near the head.

finality

finality said on

>Otoharo!
>
>While I am stating my opinion, I will go a step further. All this discussion seems to me to be head talking. Divinity is not in the head nor does the head have a function in it. Our deepest beingness is our spirituality, our divinity. No where near the head.
>
>finality

All discussion is head talking. And we do it anyway. Otherwise, the point of a forum like this would be . . . ?

Bruce

finality,

/*\ Namaste :-}}

- but are not body, mind, and spirit inseparable during our lives?

>:-}}

Reiki All Around,

All Blessings,

Firekeeper

Dear RC,
Good point. However doesn't our spirit leave our body so then of course the breath will cease when that happens.
peace,
Prosperity

prosperity,

Hi,

This begins to smell of some version of the chicken and the egg problem. One might also contend that spirit separates itself from the body only after the cessaton of the breath of sufficient duration to occasion the occurrence of death. Though, there are a few who might claim that some 'near death' experiences have fooled the spirit upon which followed a premature departure requiring the spirit to re-inhabit after the false alarm.

:)

Cheers,

RC

Life is a celebration.
A celebration of the trinity of mind, spirit, and body.
A celebration of infinite wonder and creation.
A celebration of the universe contained within the smallest molecule of every thing.
A celebration of love and compassion and understanding.
Find that part of you which remembers these things and embrace it.

Then you will truly

Walk in beauty,
Rebecca

:-))

(the you is rhetorical :-))

Hello, Esin,

>Animus/anima is another word for spirit, isn't it?

Yes. Although they have so many associated meanings, looking at the context is the only way to be sure of which meaning is appropriate in a particular instance.

Maybe we could compare its root meaning (movement) with breath.

I'm wondering about where you get the idea that the root meaning is "movement." Could you explain the etymology to which you're referring? This amateur linguist is curious.

Thanks.

Bruce

esin,

/*\ Namaste :-}}

- if spirit is part of what animates us then how can it be either good or bad?

>:-))

Reiki All Around,

All Blessings,

Firekeeper

Hmmm...not sure how that all relates to your mention of "if one wishes to remain in the mundane". I see a Spock-ish eyebrow arching on Coyote there -- always wished I could do that!

One word becomes two, two become four, until the whole chessboard is filled.

I am thinking now of Spirit as Breath, as I am teaching myself again to breathe, retrieving wispy memories of childhood practice, when I could watch the breath and be conscious of its natural rhythm, without imposing my mind's idea of the "right" rhythm. This goes with the master symbol meditation. It is simple, when I am not generating words to describe it as it happens.

Breath comes in, goes out -- that's all I really need to know and feel, everything else flows from that. Anything else I think I "know" is extraneous. That is my understanding of how many folks define Spirit.

At the same time, I feel I hear you using words to show that to define Spirit is not to grasp it, that it is not graspable in truth. Desire to grasp it chases it just beyond reach -- the lesson of Tantalus in the pool (when he reached for the fruits of the tree above, the branches swung away from his grasp; when he bent to drink from the pool he stood in, the water receded.)

We can feel the suffering of appearing to constrain Spirit every day. That is why all methods and techniques must eventually fall away, if one is to realize their aim.

Blessings,
Aronaya

Firekeeper,

Wishing to remain in the mundane implicitly says that there is somewhere else(s) to be. Ergo...

Otoharo!

masterful!

finality

Yep (pulls up six-gun belt and spits tobacco in the dust), that's why they calls me a "Reiki Master"!

Blessings,
Aronaya

Aronaya,

Lovely!

Bright blessings; hail Eris!

goldenisis

Thank ye kindly, ma'am!

Blessings,
Aronaya

aronaya,

/*\ Namaste :-}}

- you said, in part: "One word becomes two, two become four, until the whole chessboard is filled."

- is it not a necessity of chess to have some room to move??

bagl

- well, at least until Checkmate!!

>:-}}

- as for breath and spirit??

- one view is they are not identical - though they are co-existent; even symbiotic

>:-}}

Reiki All Around,

All Blessings,

Firekeeper

On the chess metaphor, I was thinking of the Zen Master's reaction to a talkative scholar, pouring his tea until the cup ran over into the saucer and onto the table. We fill up our heads with words ABOUT spirit, enlightenment, etc., and then indeed have no room to move, to breath as it were. Also was referring to the fable about the king offering the inventor of chess any gift he wanted, and the inventor asking only for enough grain to fill the chessboard with 2 to the 64th power of grains. Turned out there was not enough grain in the whole kingdom to fill the board.

Don't know yet whether breath and spirit are identical, symbiotic, related, connected, etc. Think the only way to find out is to fully experience the breath and see where it leads in awareness. Sources I've read claim a close identity between the two.

Spirit and breath - two words. Words wall us off from the reality we are trying to apprehend. "Thems as talks about it, don't know, and thems as knows, ain't sayin'."

When I shut up for good, you are welcome to celebrate my enlightenment!

Blessings,
Aronaya

aronaya,

/*\ Namaste :-}}

- I agree, lengthy posts do not a priori signal one is about to read something well thought out or sage or......

>:-}}

- and, even brief posts can be just as 'revealing' by their lack of pithiness

>:-}}

- yet, even as we speak (well, you know - bagl), I celebrate your efforts toward Enlightnement

>:-}}

- as for celebrating Enlightenment? Death will shut me up for a while, perhaps, but is no guarantee of my Enlightnement, afterall

bagl

Reiki All Around,

All Blessings,

Firekeeper