The Reiki Cafe 

What is enlightenment?

Is it a state perfection, the end of the spiritual journey?

A relative term, as in there is no end state to infinity?

Are there stages of enlightenment?

Does one have an ego when enlightened?

Does one have a personality when enlightened?

Does an enlightened person have emotions such as anger or joy?

Does an enlightened person get sick?

Does an enlightened person have desires?

Does an enlightened person have karma?

Does an enlightened person make mistakes?

Does an enlightened person know everything…transcendental knowledge?

Does an enlightened person have infinite abilities?

Does an enlightened person have to work within the laws of physics?

Does an enlightened person have infinite energy/power?

Is an enlightened person one with God?

How can we tell if we are enlightened?

How can we tell if someone else is enlightened?

Do you have any other comments or questions on enlightenment??

Hope this makes for an interesting discussion for the three day weekend!

rich

Oh…I almost forgot,

Is enlightenment permanent or could it come and go?

Feel free to answer all or any of the questions
Or
Ask your own

rich

I'll let you know when I get there.

Yes !!
That has got to be the best answer so far!!

That is how I feel as well.

I have all kinds of theories but in the end who knows until you get there. rich

meanwhile, aid to any path to any kind of enlightenment can start with the friends here.

cheers....

starjasmine

lots to see .... and check out!

Hi Roxy
But will you know when you get there (LOL)

Namaste

Rob
Friendship with oneself is all-important, because without it one cannot be friends with anyone else in the world.
Eleanor Roosevelt

I suspect I'll just know it. ;-P

Most of the classical definitions of enlightenment that I have read describe it as a state of perfection, the end of the spiritual journey. But I have always asked…if life and the universe are infinite and creative (in other words the universe is infinitely creative. It is always seeking, creating and exploring) how can there be an end??

I asked Yogi Amrit Desie once and he answered,

Enlightenment is not the end because, I was right, there is no end, life is infinite. In the enlightened state a person becomes one with the ever expanding infinite creative journey of the life/the universe.

This makes sense to me but who knows until you get there.

rich

Rich,

/*\ Namaste :-}}

- is it not the questions that matter??

- are not answers only transient Illusions?

>:-}}

Reiki All Around,

All Blessings,

Firekeeper

roxy,

/*\ Namaste :-}}

- get where?

bagl

Reiki All Around,

All Blessings,

Firekeeper

rich,

Is the search for enlightenment just another illusion?

Lots of wood to chop and water to carry . Gotta run.

Walk in beauty,
Rebecca

Otoharo!

Rich, I have been asking this question for years. We do not use the term, so I have no idea. I do know that I use to see dark when I closed my eyes. That is my aura had dark energy in it. Now when I close my eyes, I see light. Does that mean my aura is now light and does that correlate to enlightenment. I do not know. Since we do not use the term I do not know what it means specifically. It is a term from someone's else dictionary.

I do know that I have achieved the highest level a human can acheive (before I lost it all). Somewhere in that growth was the state of enlightenment, but since no one will give me their definition, than I do not know where it is.

finality

Equations:

enlightment = these things?
~ seeing other dimensions?
~ expanding one's horizons
~ seeing invisible objects and uncommon solutions
~ visiting the one's alternative view points (seeing more than one side of anything e.g. dissusions)
~ many other unexpected events and experiences

cheers to keen learners who find more and more to add in their wisdom bank
starjasmine

hi Finality,
I don't mind if you re-encounter your experiences. Like to hear more of the path you walked on.

Starjasmine

ps: share your version and feel entitled to definite the perimeters of enightenment as you know it.

Words are tools; they are seldom attatched to extremely specific items etc

Firekeeper,

And in whose profile is the quote (I paraphrase). "A true traveler has no set destination, and is not intent upon arriving?"

Roxy

How are we to know if we are enlightend? Would not an enlightend person have to tell us that we reached this stage? Would we know we are enlightened merely because we are? Who are we to say we are enlightened? Hmmm...
My brain hurts!
Tracey

Firekeeper
No answers are not only transient illusions

Some answers are correct truths, I think.

besides, what is a question without at least the attempt of an answer.

rich

Rebecca
Enlightenment is supposed to be the end of illusion.
Is it?

Perhaps being in the moment and ending the search is enlightenment

More questions than answers
rich

Finality
“I have achieved the highest level a human can acheive (before I lost it all).”

could you explain this?

rich

Hard to say.

I have seen the term used in two ways:

"Enlightenment" as we are discussing.

And " enlightenment " in which ones comes to knowing of a particular thing. I see the lowercase version as steps to the capital E version.

I've always heard it said that when you get there you just know you are there. But it seems general consensus amongst the various sources I've seen say that it's not the kind of thing you can explain. you just "know". But it's hard to put it in words so that others can understand. they have to discover it for themselves.

As for what it is. I would say at the very least it is the highest achievement of spiritual evolution we can reach in this particular existence. That being said who knows if there are other levels or not. But i always think of it as the pinnacle of the spiritual journey.Whether it is THE highest state of knowing or just the highest state we can achieve in this level of existence is really irrelevant. I feel it's still the point we should get to while here.

I have also seen it said numerous times that those who look for it never find it. This to me means we just simply have to Be. In Being I think we percieve more of Truth than we would otherwise. But I think we will still continue to grow and learn and expand spiritually even once we achieve Being permanently.

The question is do we really start from being unenlightened? Is it something we achieve over time? Or is it an intrinsic part of who we are that we have momentarily forgotten? And all we have to do is go " oh yeah i'm enligtened" and truly accept it discarding all that we formerly thought we knew.

HiDave
I have seen it written that we are born into oneness, but grow out of it very early on and then struggle to get it back (LOL)
I wonder if oneness is the same as elightenment both in principle and actuality?

Namaste

Rob
Friendship with oneself is all-important, because without it one cannot be friends with anyone else in the world.
Eleanor Roosevelt

Is enlightenment oneness with everything as in Hinduism?
Or
Is it oneness with nothing, the great void, as in Buddhism?
Or
Is it something else?
Or
We can even question the very relationship between enlightenment and oneness altogether, as you did.

More questions than answers
rich

I will take a stab at this discussion.

Enlightenment by definition was an 18th Century rationalistic movement, the study of human culture and the natural world.
Those of us doing energy study and work; study the natural world as well as the supernatural/spiritual levels.

Are we enlightened? by definition are we free of ignorance, prejudice or superstition? Are we well-informed, open-minded, understanding of all the known facts of things spiritual or religious and it resulting in transcendence of human suffering and desire?

Those are some definitions.

For me personal realization of becoming enlightened is that we must become before we can be.
Working through karma's past and present.
Garnering knowledge and discerning what rings true for us through applying it and experiences.
Working through old belief systems and exploring new beliefs/concepts and experiences. Be open-minded but use discernment.
Attaining belief in one's self, attaining beliefs through personal experiences and not what has been written by one buddah or one sage or taught to us by any one. It is finding our truth and what works for us.
Becoming enlightened is a personal journey unique to ourself. For me it is a journey of coming from the spiritual into the physical and then experiencing the paths I have chosen, discerning these experiences, striving for more knowledge and experiences, realizing that the path evolves into the neverending circle of life/all.
Many new lessons learned this past week. When I am foolish enough to think or even to believe I am strong, I am tested and find I am still weak. When I think I am weak other lessons comes along and I realize just how strong I am.

So if we can be truly enlightened perhaps it will be the last AHA light bulb moment that we can know on this level? Does knowing if we are enlightened really mean anthing? To me it is a constant work in progress. Afterall it is the path we journey on and what we learn, apply and put out there to help ourself and others that energizes all matter positively and increases the process of becoming enlightened

All blessings,
Donna

Otoharo!

Rich, not long ago someone asked me to retell my story and I did. I am not retelling it again.

finality

Hi Rich
But isn't that the way it is?
Would we really be questioning it if we knew the answears?
At the end of the day does it really matter?
I suppose it does if we are trying to attain it, because we are then aware of the goal, but by setting ourselves the goal are we then not missing the point? (LOL)

If we just are, then we have made it, or have we? (LOL)

Another question? have you ever met anyone who you would consider to be elightened and do you know if they considered themselves to be? Do you know if anyone considers you to be enlightened? (they may not say it to your face)

I do see elightement as a series of knowings, Like when you are full of questions then realise that you know all of the answears, it is just the questions that you don't have.

Or perhaps when you can see a situation as if thru the eyes and mind of a child, like the magic of seeing snow for the first time or perhaps your first christmas etc. You can marvel at the wonder of it all and look at it with innocence and joy.

It does seem that the more we ask that the more we have to ask LOL.

Namaste

Rob
Friendship with oneself is all-important, because without it one cannot be friends with anyone else in the world.
Eleanor Roosevelt